Running solo boat Empty. . No trolling motor

[NOTGSXR]

I know there's tons of talk about balance.. but say your boat is mostly empty except for a couple vests or other light things.... also trolling motor removed..

I can say it leans right for sure and it was especially noticeable when I broke 80.... but drove really smooth... very smooth and little input unless it was already automated lol just leaning right side low...

I am a noob.. it is an XB21 Prosport with a 250xs/1.75 and a 28 Promax. This was my 4th time out in it and really only the 2nd time I got to really make an effort to get on it.....

Is it better to learn in this condition under these circumstances?

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Thx

Dan

 

[scj]

With the weight biased to the right, it will seem easier to drive as you're constantly applying left input to the wheel for correcting chine. Keep adding weight on the left to aid the balance and you'll learn how to keep in on pad with little steering input.

 

[GotMyAlly]

I've had the opposite experience from above. All of my Allisons have seemed to drive better with weight biased to the left. May seem to lean to the left under 80, but above that point the left side starts to lift. If the weight isn't biased to the left at rest, you'll have a right lean at WOT. If I was trying to make a solo/light load run, I'd either use a bag of shot or move batts, etc. The best driving Allisons are true center steers, but sometimes I wonder how a left hand drive would do for light load runs (Stroker has built one or two like that). That would likely eliminate the need for ballast.

 

[scj]

I'm not saying they drive better, I'm saying for a beginner, it's easier to keep it on plane if the boat wants to lean right at 70 to 80 mph. That way the constant pressure to turn left helps them catch the chine walk. I always set mine a little heavier to portside as it's pretty common to run high 80's to low 90's on my outings.

My ProSport is set up with off-set steering and side slide drivers seat. This allows me to drive from starboard side and mostly centered. This reduces the amount of ballast if I run solo compared to my 2+2.

 

[NOTGSXR]

I have read over and over the posts on here about left pressure etc.. but have honestly found that to hurt my learning curve..... if you get to the washing the sides point. .. my perception was that the wheel is trying to stay neutral as the boat is flopping... it's almost as if the steering wheel wants to remain stationary while the boat is rotating from left to right.. this in turn will keep the outboard relationship with the water more consistent and stable.. and when you can do that.... she will settle down... at least in my mind.. that's what my limited experience tells me... needless to say.. I'm probably going to go out on the lake in a few.... don't have any lead shot at the moment and boat is empty.

Dan

 

[Bobalouie]

I am not sure I fully understood what you wrote there, but an Allison will not "settle down" without constant input from the steering wheel. They are a driver's boat, and have to be driven. Some folks have good handling and have less pressure / movement at the wheel than others, but it is just like balancing a bike. You are always making corrections at the handlebars to control your balance. Same thing with the steering wheel in an Allison.

 

[NOTGSXR]

Bobalouie,

I guess what I'm saying is something like. .. as the boat goes.. so does the motor... if boat pitches one way.. Motor does as well and if you don't lessen the force on the motor as it pushes into the water sideways it will make matters worse as the pivot points and such change.. if you balance the steering and the motor the boat will follow..

That's why I said to me it feels more like you're only trying to keep the steering neutral as best as possible when it gets to the point of washing the sides...

As far as left pressure goes... i read that advice over and over and I haven't had good luck.. there are times I have to go right to prevent washing the sides!

As time is going on.. it seems less and less input and smaller adjustments are being made.. This is surely the seat time as you guys all have said..

I just want to be clear I am not at all contradicting or questioning anyone at all.. Just sharing my perhaps unusual interpretation of what's happening to me in one of the best boats that we all share. As time goes on I'll hopefully get it right without too many issues and be able to explain myself better.. I again will thank Darris for the use of Bucket seats though!

I also thank all of you guys for the comradery and support for the passions we all share!

Dan

 

[Bobalouie]

Ok, I got what you are saying. Yes, you will have to flick it to the right. On my boat it was hold pressure and flick it to the left then counter a little to the right, back and forth. Sometimes you flick to the left a little too far and have to flick it right farther than normal to get it back to balanced.

My advise is this: dont let the boat drive you. What I mean by that is that you need to set up the pattern of left right left, dont let the boat do it for you. The boat is going to want to fall off of the pad to one side or the other and you dont want to let it do that. If the boat does it first and you try to catch it, you will be behind and have to make big corrections to get the boat settled, which once behind the pattern too far results in washing the sides.

So, start out with a little pressure to the left and give it a quick 1-2" flick to the left and return to the original position, or a little to the right as necessary. That way you are kind of telling the boat, "yes, it is OK to fall over left, but whoa, not too far". If you set up the pattern, the boat becomes easy to drive very quickly. I dont know about most other peoples boats, but the faster mine went, the less input was necessary. Above 90 mph my boat would just about drive itself with very little steering corrections - both less distance (probably only 1/2" either way) and not quick jerks more a slow movement. At 65-70 mph it required a lot of correction. Whipper has a great video on here of him driving with the shot showing his hands on the wheel. His hand movements look identical to what I am trying to convey with words. If I had seen that video before I tried figuring it out myself, I probably would have cut my learning curve in half or better.

All that being said, every Allison drives a little bit different, so you will have to find your own style, which it sounds like you are well on the way to doing.

 

[dubmoney]

Can anyone point me to the video of whipper driving his boat?

 

[Bobalouie]

For whippers video

http://forum.allisonowners.com/index.php?media/allison-grand-sport-youtube.33/

 

[NOTGSXR]

Ok, I got what you are saying. Yes, you will have to flick it to the right. On my boat it was hold pressure and flick it to the left then counter a little to the right, back and forth. Sometimes you flick to the left a little too far and have to flick it right farther than normal to get it back to balanced.

My advise is this: dont let the boat drive you. What I mean by that is that you need to set up the pattern of left right left, dont let the boat do it for you. The boat is going to want to fall off of the pad to one side or the other and you dont want to let it do that. If the boat does it first and you try to catch it, you will be behind and have to make big corrections to get the boat settled, which once behind the pattern too far results in washing the sides.

So, start out with a little pressure to the left and give it a quick 1-2" flick to the left and return to the original position, or a little to the right as necessary. That way you are kind of telling the boat, "yes, it is OK to fall over left, but whoa, not too far". If you set up the pattern, the boat becomes easy to drive very quickly. I dont know about most other peoples boats, but the faster mine went, the less input was necessary. Above 90 mph my boat would just about drive itself with very little steering corrections - both less distance (probably only 1/2" either way) and not quick jerks more a slow movement. At 65-70 mph it required a lot of correction. Whipper has a great video on here of him driving with the shot showing his hands on the wheel. His hand movements look identical to what I am trying to convey with words. If I had seen that video before I tried figuring it out myself, I probably would have cut my learning curve in half or better.

All that being said, every Allison drives a little bit different, so you will have to find your own style, which it sounds like you are well on the way to doing.

Such a great help. Thank you so much! Really appreciate your insight! I'm reasonably sure instincts are taking over a bit where I know what it's trying to do without exactly knowing I am making small corrections...



Dan

 

[NOTGSXR]

For whippers video

http://forum.allisonowners.com/index.php?media/allison-grand-sport-youtube.33/

I completely get this and if you look closely the boat pitches right and he turns slightly left.. as if to keep the motor from pitching as well...

boat is moving inherently. . I feel we are making corrections to prevent the motor from following. .

Dan

 

[hirk]

Most people over steer (make wheel adjustments when not needed thus creating walk) when learning. once you get the timing of bumping the wheel down pat you tend to bump it much less assuming the boat is setup decent

 

[xb03fs]

Bobalouie hit the nail on the head.

65-75 is the most difficult area to drive in, faster or slower, are much easier.

The better the boat is balanced, the less imput is needed especially at high speed.

I will add, if there is a right lean at 80, the boat is out of balance and mph is being left on the table.

 

[NOTGSXR]

Bobalouie hit the nail on the head.

65-75 is the most difficult area to drive in, faster or slower, are much easier.

The better the boat is balanced, the less imput is needed especially at high speed.

I will add, if there is a right lean at 80, the boat is out of balance and mph is being left on the table.

Boat is definitely out of balance. Trolling motor missing doesn't help there lol. I get what you guys are saying about less input etc. in general and know a lot of speed is left on the table. In due time!

Please keep the help coming.. How about turning? Turning at speed? I found that I feel more comfortable lowering the trim a bit before turning but some say that is not correct. Any thoughts? Thx.

Dan

 

[scj]

Dan,
Neutral trim (prop level with pad) is as low as you need to take the trim as long as you don't slow too much to where the boat starts to porpoise.

I haven't read how your boat is set up?

 

[NOTGSXR]

Dan,
Neutral trim (prop level with pad) is as low as you need to take the trim as long as you don't slow too much to where the boat starts to porpoise.

I haven't read how your boat is set up?

It's set up to where Lee said "it likes to be there" on the jack plate. Where that relates to anything. .. I am not sure. . But I can tell you this... when I get trimmed up to just about 6.5 - 7 on my smartcraft. .. it feels like the parachute I was dragging in the water was let go.. it really frees up... to me it's insane how much it releases at that point.

 

[xb03fs]

If you lower the bow too much your turn will be much sharper than intended...

 

[NOTGSXR]

If you lower the bow too much your turn will be much sharper than intended...

I'm sure lol.. ok.. so nobody bumps the trim down to turn?

 

[scj]

You should really know where your engine height is.........1/4"under vs. 1/4" over drives quite a bit different. My hole shots are much better at 1/4" over with my trim at + 25% (same as 2.5 on your gauge).

If you're running 75 mph and taking gradual turns, no, no need to touch the trim if you're slightly positive of neutral trim. If I'm horsing around and I'm going to drop down to 45 mph and do a bat turn I take it to 60% and it'll turn like a fair ride.