S
Scott Gilmore
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EXACTLY !!!! Scott :?2fast4mom said:
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- Thread starter darin
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One other thing I cannot clearly understand.
If the sleeves for the bolts are welded to some internal metal plate sandwiched in the transom, then HOW do the bolt heads, washers, flanges and pieces of the interior laminate pull through this internal metal plate?
That would mean that they would have had to punch their way through this interior metal plate, right? :?:
If the sleeves for the bolts are welded to some internal metal plate sandwiched in the transom, then HOW do the bolt heads, washers, flanges and pieces of the interior laminate pull through this internal metal plate?
That would mean that they would have had to punch their way through this interior metal plate, right? :?:
Looks like maybe...I just decided which A-BOAT to bring to next year's TN RALLY! :wink:
JR
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Lou,
It almost seems that there could be more than one design involved. One has sleeves, whose ends contact the inside of the gel coat and the other has flat plates inside and out [internal], with no sleeves/larger I.D. sleeves.
Or.... Maybe the vendor [of the bad plates] made sockets [the O.D. of the sleeves] in the outside/inside plate that the sleeves would slide into. The sleeves would butt up against the gel coat and could pull through the plates [along with the bolt head and securing washer], passing through the socket openings if the welds failed. This would be possible if the sleeve's tube wall was very thick.
JR
It almost seems that there could be more than one design involved. One has sleeves, whose ends contact the inside of the gel coat and the other has flat plates inside and out [internal], with no sleeves/larger I.D. sleeves.
Or.... Maybe the vendor [of the bad plates] made sockets [the O.D. of the sleeves] in the outside/inside plate that the sleeves would slide into. The sleeves would butt up against the gel coat and could pull through the plates [along with the bolt head and securing washer], passing through the socket openings if the welds failed. This would be possible if the sleeve's tube wall was very thick.
JR
Myron
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I could be wrong on this but I think that the reason for the sleeves were for the the first generation of foam transoms, I beleave there was no steel inside of those and the sleeves was to prevent the crushing of the transom, later they put the plates inside the transom (glassed in) and changed the layup on the transom and no longer use the sleeves.
whipper
Well-Known Member
bolts
JR I read your coment. Now im just trying to picture it. I get the didnt mater if the bolts were tight or loose part ,and sleave welded to a plate ect. There is a lot of stress on the transom and the bolts while on the trailer when ya hit a bump too. Those transom savers must be used also.
JR I read your coment. Now im just trying to picture it. I get the didnt mater if the bolts were tight or loose part ,and sleave welded to a plate ect. There is a lot of stress on the transom and the bolts while on the trailer when ya hit a bump too. Those transom savers must be used also.
JR
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I am not a big fan of transom savers. There are quite a few boat builders who don't recommend them either. I just tilt my engine until the powerhead weight brings the CG to balance on top of the transom. The real transom killer is the thrust from the GC levering the bow upward, which generates a tilt load.
I do agree the boathull needs to be tightly secured at the rear of the trailer in order to make the trailer springs take the impacts. I see trailered boats all the time with no tie downs with the hull bouncing on the bunks going over bumps. The springs on the trailer are being underutilized. The great thing about boat trailers is that there is very low amounts of unsprung weight ["shades" of motocross terms].
Myron,
Susan and I thought about you a couple of weeks ago when we Stayed at the Radisson-Cordova Beach. I can easily see why you live in Melbourne/Cocoa/Sebastian. We put about 150 miles on the Jet Ski [actually a Honda Turbo] cruising from Titusville down to Vero Beach in the ICW and Atlantic. We also took the 'ski South from Lake Washinton into Alligatorville/airboat land [about 20 miles South of Lake Washinton].
The Indian and Sebastian Rivers also look like a great place to tear up a Gearcase so I'm glad we took the 'ski.
We hope to spend some time there again next Summer on the way to the Keys.
JR
I do agree the boathull needs to be tightly secured at the rear of the trailer in order to make the trailer springs take the impacts. I see trailered boats all the time with no tie downs with the hull bouncing on the bunks going over bumps. The springs on the trailer are being underutilized. The great thing about boat trailers is that there is very low amounts of unsprung weight ["shades" of motocross terms].
Myron,
Susan and I thought about you a couple of weeks ago when we Stayed at the Radisson-Cordova Beach. I can easily see why you live in Melbourne/Cocoa/Sebastian. We put about 150 miles on the Jet Ski [actually a Honda Turbo] cruising from Titusville down to Vero Beach in the ICW and Atlantic. We also took the 'ski South from Lake Washinton into Alligatorville/airboat land [about 20 miles South of Lake Washinton].
The Indian and Sebastian Rivers also look like a great place to tear up a Gearcase so I'm glad we took the 'ski.
We hope to spend some time there again next Summer on the way to the Keys.
JR
Myron
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Hey JR, I live right down the street from the Lake Washington boat ramp, Next time you come this way let me know. Been busy with Trevor racing MX, so I have not had much time for boating, but I did buy a GS to go with my 2003 also blew the motor on one of our Yamaha jet skies, actually Kitty did Ha Ha.
J
John Richied
Guest
Lou this would concern me… If you installed a new jackplate or bolts and the first few times you were able to snug the transom bolts a little, no big deal. But if you keep finding you can snug them then I would think that you are stretching the bolts or compressing the transom? Either that or the nuts are actually backing off?2fast4mom said:
froggy
Active Member
Lou,
No one has clarified if the bolts came alll the way through the transom or just penetrated the outside laminations. If they came all the way through, the outboard would have come completely off.
The purpose of the "sleeves/nipples" is to keep you from over compresssing a composite transom. You can only compress the sleeve so much. If your nuts are coming loose, I'd double nut or find good nylocks, because the nuts should never come loose, under normal circumstances.
froggy
No one has clarified if the bolts came alll the way through the transom or just penetrated the outside laminations. If they came all the way through, the outboard would have come completely off.
The purpose of the "sleeves/nipples" is to keep you from over compresssing a composite transom. You can only compress the sleeve so much. If your nuts are coming loose, I'd double nut or find good nylocks, because the nuts should never come loose, under normal circumstances.
froggy
The report that JBarczak provided a link to, indicated the motor fell off the boat.
Yellowallison
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7 pages later after DARIN's "SURPRISE" where did he go - ???? :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink:
K
Kevin from FL
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There was so much to read, he fell asleep Yeller :lol:
Yellowallison
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HEY KEV!! .... have YU ever have wondered if LULU and JR are from the same FAMILY tree ??? :mrgreen:
K
Kevin from FL
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I shudder at the thought Yeller :lol:
JR is my DADDY! :lol:
S
Scott Gilmore
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froggy said:
I clarified that about 4 pages ago YES the bolts came all the way through the transom with 2in pieces of boat attached !!! The lower jackplate bolts still held the motor on however there was a HUGE indent the size of my jackplate about 3in deep in the bottom of my transom. NICE REAL NICE !!!Scott :cry: :roll:
MAY BE JUST MAYBE if you got jacked around by Allison for 2 plus months on a problem that was 1000% their fault on a 29k boat (1997 money) some of you people wouldn't be so quick to defend them. I've got ONE HELL of a story with these people if anyone cares to listen. :x
Um...just a vacuous observation....but wouldn't one call the above a TRANSOM FAILURE? :?:
J
John Richied
Guest
Lou what is the deal with wanting to call it a transom failure or transom mounting failure or whatever. It is what it is and I don’t see any reason to try to discredit the Allison name or claim.
Obviously the 1998 and older Grand Sports require an upgrade if they have not already had it. I have yet to see any boat or auto manufacture have a perfect record. This was a serious, but honest manufacturing mistake, not an intentional misrepresentation.
Obviously the 1998 and older Grand Sports require an upgrade if they have not already had it. I have yet to see any boat or auto manufacture have a perfect record. This was a serious, but honest manufacturing mistake, not an intentional misrepresentation.
Pinkie I'm not trying to discredit anyone or anything. I just want to get some clarity about this problem.
How is this transom different than any other Allison? That's the key issue to me.
How would you define "transom failure"? Does the transom have to fall off the boat?
How is this transom different than any other Allison? That's the key issue to me.
How would you define "transom failure"? Does the transom have to fall off the boat?
J
John Richied
Guest
Well I have no firsthand experience with this problem other then what I have read and it still seems to be clear to me as I said above. “Obviously the 1998 and older Grand Sports require an upgrade if they have not already had it. “2fast4mom said:
The 1998 and older Grand Sports have an upgrade kit.2fast4mom said:
Again, how is this going to change the current situation??? What are you digging for here?2fast4mom said:
I’ll tell you what frost my azz is you turn this (that is very serious situation) or applying your registration numbers into a frickin’ drama but don’t post a word about when someone does you wrong intentionally. The older Grand Sport problem was and is a manufacturing mistake… an honest mistake!
You own four GPI engines, one JSRE, a box stock 300 Merc drag and you act like all has gone well… Well I know differently and you should be giving credit where credit is due to the one or the many and speaking the truth about the rest.
I don’t give a damn what high-performance hull you own, we are on the Internet to share information to better each other and share experience. If you hide a problem you had or have, then you are part of the problem in my opinion. Just the same lets hear about the good stuff that works! And Lou this is not just pointed at you.
A controversial discussion I am up for, one that has no point or just slams with no personal experience means crap to me…
The Allisons have offered high-performance hulls that have had the reputation of no stress cracks, the strongest transom in the industry, and some of the fastest damn V-pad hulls ever made. They did this all with very little advertisement, but word of mouth sold their boats from Japan to all over our good old USA.
Is there Allison hulls with stress crack or transom damage, hell yeah… Ask Scott Gilmore about the XB-2002 he bought from Randy and sold shortly after. You don’t see him posting about that do you…and there are others but it is rare!
And Darin who started this post (you the man), we the Allison owners need to roll out the red carpet for you…
Welcome to the Allison owners site Darin, your post may have saved injury and or lives to other GrandSport owners. I hope you still own an Allison and enjoy it as much as we do. Your post was sincere and it’s nice to hear that there was not a lawsuit involved as some of this money grubbing world goes for the throat and $$$ in such a situation. It’s refreshing to see someone like you handle this in a matter to warn others.